Iraqi Abuse Photos Spark Shock

[Biggles]

Difficult to say. With modern technology anything is possible. What is certain is that she has a most disturbing smile.

[Sparkle1984]

Originally posted by james_bond_rulez@4 May 2004 - 08:42
Western societies, civilized or not, are still consisted of humans, they are just as fallible as people from developing countries and undeveloped countries.

In war, people do all kinds of nasty stuff to other human beings. Americans soldiers got humilated and dragged around the street and displayed as trophies. American prison officiers and the army secretly torturing Iraqis prisoners illegally.

Who is to say who is right and who is wrong?

We are all sinners.

It's no good to just sigh and say "we are all sinners" and try and conveniently sweep it under the carpet.

Surely the USA should be setting an example, and treating people like that is hardly going to set a good example to other countries, is it?

[james_bond_rulez]

you are right, although i am just merely pointing out that we are all capable of carrying out sinful acts such as this

[Biggles]

This is really rumbling on. The pictures in the Glasgow Herald today were most unpleasant. I had not realised that these had appeared in Arabic newspapers weeks ago. Is this what was referred to as despicable lies a couple of weeks ago at a Coalition press conference?

If it is then I suspect we have minus credibility rating in the region at the moment. However, I was quite impressed to see GW take the bull by the horns and go over there and apologise. That could not have been particularly pleasing for him as he launches his re-election campaign. I think the soldiers implicated might well consider a long holiday in Sweden or Canada (a very long holiday) as they are unlikely to be on the Whitehouse Christmas Card list.

[james_bond_rulez]

just saw the live televised broadcast seeing Rumsfeld defend his sorry ass

I am still not convinced, I dont trust the bastard...

he should be fired

[clunk1234567]

wether the photos are fake i don't know. I do know that the soldiers get up every morning waiting to have a leg or arm blown off. I do know that they're very, very scared, and that fear is total. I do know that a major part of theyre job is getting to a scene after a bomb has gone off to witness the most harrowing of sights. If those photos are true, then it's wrong in a big way, but after what our guys have been through i just don't hear the complaints as loudly as some.

[BigBank_Hank]

Originally posted by james_bond_rulez@7 May 2004 - 13:12
he should be fired

Firing may be a bit harsh. I think that he got the message when the President scolded him earlier in the week for with holding the pictures for so long.

[Rat Faced]

GENEVA (Reuters) - The International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) said on Thursday it had repeatedly urged the United States to take "corrective action" at a Baghdad jail at the center of a scandal over abuse of Iraqi prisoners.

The Geneva-based humanitarian agency, mandated under international treaties to visit detainees, has had regular access to Abu Ghraib prison since U.S.-led forces began using it last year, according to chief spokeswoman Antonella Notari.

"The ICRC, aware of the situation, and based on its findings, has repeatedly asked the U.S. authorities to take corrective action," she told Reuters.

Notari declined to give details of what the ICRC had seen during the visits, which take place every five to six weeks, or about its reports to the U.S. authorities.

The United Nations said separately it had written to U.S. officials, including Secretary of State Colin Powell and Governor of Iraq Paul Bremer, seeking information on human rights in Iraq over the past year.

The Office of the U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights, which has promised a report by the end of the month, said its investigators were ready to visit Baghdad for talks with coalition and Iraqi leaders.

The ICRC, which has been operating since the late 19th century, keeps a public silence about what it hears from detainees as the price for gaining access to jails in trouble spots around the world from Chechnya to West Africa.

Pictures of grinning U.S. soldiers abusing naked Iraqis at Abu Ghraib -- the largest prison in the country and notorious for torture under Iraqi President Saddam Hussein -- have sparked an international outcry.

In a bid to limit damage to the U.S. image, President Bush went on two Arabic satellite television stations on Wednesday to tell an outraged Middle East that soldiers guilty of abusing Iraqi prisoners would be punished.

WANTON CRIMINAL ABUSES

The jail was also been the focus of a separate earlier probe by a U.S. general.

That report by Major-General Antonio Taguba, covering the period October-December 2003 and completed on March 3, cited incidents of "sadistic, blatant and wanton criminal abuses."
Notari poured cold water on some U.S. media reports suggesting that the ICRC had not had access to a special wing in the jail where the abuse took place.

"To the best of our knowledge we have had access to all sectors," she said.

And she rejected a proposal from the new head of the jail, Major-General Geoffrey Miller, that the ICRC set up a permanent presence there, saying: "We are not going to be part of their organization."

The ICRC has visited thousands of prisoners under the control of U.S. and British forces, which are also being investigated after a British newspaper published pictures of a soldier apparently urinating on an Iraqi detainee.

But Notari declined to comment on what officials had seen in British-run jails.

Under the Geneva Conventions on both prisoners and the treatment of civilians in wartime, the ICRC must be allowed to interview detainees in private and on a regular basis.

On these terms, it has carried out two visits to Saddam, in U.S. custody since his capture shortly before Christmas.

"It is important that people understand our role, which is to be present and to have a dialogue with the authorities," Notari said.

But on a few occasions the Red Cross has broken its vow of silence because either the authority concerned has issued a partial account of the ICRC's findings or has simply failed to take any action after a long period.

The ICRC recently expressed mounting frustration over the situation of Afghan and other detainees at the U.S. naval base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, announcing that its concerns about conditions and treatment were not being addressed.

Source


There is a huge difference between finding out about something and immediately acting on it, as Bush is claiming, and sitting on your arse and doing nothing (thereby condoning it) until it hits the public domain and causes an outcry....which is apparently whats happened.

They knew about this stuff Last Year and acted by committee rather than kicking arses, the committee reported over 2 months ago.....

Now that the public knows, action gets taken... co-incidence?


I wonder if the same warnings have been totally ignored by the UK Government. Somehow that would not surprise me...

[BigBank_Hank]

There's no doubt that there was some feet dragging. What it does prove though is that the system is working. It was never swept under the rug and never cover up. Secretary Rumsfeld said today that an investigation was under way and that's why they hadn't come forward yet. He said that they didn't want to jeopardize the investigation by making this information public before the investigation was complete.

[TROUBLE^MAKER]

Reminds me of a college fraternity.