Why I am frustrated on the lack of KO's...

[hobbes]

Okay, Mr. Cloud. But I really have a problem with your signature. I can't help it. I don't mean to criticize. But I be listening to my sig these days.

Not all Liberals dislike guns.

Not all Republicans like them. They scare me. Bring on the rust.


Damn that felt good.

Make-up sex can be fiercely satisfiying.

Not sure why I said that, carrry on.

[Busyman]

I must have misheard, I guess. I sure thought he said we need about forty thousand more troops in Iraq both the first debate and this one. But yet he said he would not use the national guard or enforce the draft. He will pay soldiers more, benefits, etc., and get them this way. Did I just imagine all that?

No, I remember it clearly now. Because when he said that, Bush remarked about his voting down the bill for more money for our troops.



Edited to add second paragraph

More of our troops?

That might sense if he's really talking about securing the peace however he talked about getting other countries' troops.

I'm amazed at what people remember clearly. No offense Everose but your memory is a little cloudy and with that I'm also amazed at the folks who back up cloudy memories (cue in Cloudseeder) when it goes along with there little agenda.

Kerry said during his administration he wanted to add 40,000 more troops to active duty military. He also said our National Guard and reservists are treated like active duty military currently and that there are now stop-loss measures implemented so one must add 3 more years to active duty.

Bush talked about Kerry cutting down the intelligence budget by like 70 (or was it 7) billion dollars on a whole other question.

Now I'm going on memory too but I'm pretty sure about this since I heard something similar before about stop-loss measurements in the military.

I know folks that lost their sons in Iraq and the dislike (to put it mildly) they have for Bush.

Please folks get your facts straight before you are so sure of something.

[Biggles]

Busyman

I think the 90% casualties is correct. As the US has upwards of 85% of the forces out there and AQ etc., have a preference for killing US soldiers, the 90% figure is not really out of kilter with the situation on the ground.

[Everose]

I'm amazed at what people remember clearly. No offense Everose but your memory is a little cloudy and with that I'm also amazed at the folks who back up cloudy memories (cue in Cloudseeder) when it goes along with there little agenda.

Busyman, this surprises me about you. Notice I pulled this little paragraph out and separated it from the rest of your post. I hate to say it, but when remarks are made in these threads like this, I don't even read the rest of the post.

I guess my first question would be what 'little agenda' are you accusing me, (or was it Cloudseeder) of having? I have no agenda. I do have a lot of questions, and I will repeat what I hear in a debate. If you would kindly tell me what you heard, I am open to that. We are humans, and our perceptions are often different. I would be the last to think my perceptions are the right ones. Am I wrong in bringing what I perceive to this board for discussion? Have you not, in other posts encouraged people to listen, question and think? It is remembering that which makes me really surprised that all of a sudden you think I have an agenda.

And let me make one thing clear here. If you think I have any control over Mr. Cloud, or would "use' him to back up a non existant agenda, you don't know Mr. Cloud or myself. I don't use people, Busyman. It is pretty rare that he and I agree on issues. I will not tell him not to agree with me on the rare occassion he does.

Okay.........now that I have that said, I will read the rest of your post. ..... :lol:

[vidcc]

firstly folks if you are going to state "facts" try to actually use facts and not spin that either candidate has said. Remember a bill has many components and both parties add unacceptable components to bills as well as acceptable components and a no vote for a bill untill the unacceptable component is removed isn't the same as voting against the acceptable component. don't fall for political games.

to the thread:

firstly on the resolution point. the sanctions were working...yes they were breaking down but then the job is to strengthen them...that was not attempted...now we have the information that saddam wasn't an imminet threat somehow the focus must shift to say we were right but not for the reasons we said....but the fact remains that's goalpost changing for the reasons we did it.

Bush did use the oil for food but to justify his own actions, not against Kerry because it will be seen as trying to deflect the fact of his flawed reasons for war...and kerry and the rest of the world will throw that back in his face.
As to Kerry ignoring the "coilition" yes he could use a bit better turn of phrase but his job isn't to show Bush in a positive light...it's to show his mess ups.

New rule: Everyone has to stop pretending that George Bush is so macho
Because, plainly, he acts like a girl. Not a woman -- a girl. Not a week goes by when John Kerry isn’t attacked because he said something that hurt someone’s feelings. According to Bush spokesmen, Kerry lost the first debate because of his "new insult" to our allies when he said the coalition wasn’t genuine. Poland had Lithuania over for a debate party that night, and now they can’t look at each other without crying.

Bill Maher

the full quote when i can find it

[Everose]

More of our troops?

That might sense if he's really talking about securing the peace however he talked about getting other countries' troops.

I realize he is for getting more help from other countries. But I understood him to say that in order to get these troops and keep them, we need to pay them more, better benefits,etc. And it was at this point Bush was taken aback and said that Kerry himself had help vote down a bill which would do just that.

I'm amazed at what people remember clearly. No offense Everose but your memory is a little cloudy and with that I'm also amazed at the folks who back up cloudy memories (cue in Cloudseeder) when it goes along with there little agenda.

Kerry said during his administration he wanted to add 40,000 more troops to active duty military. He also said our National Guard and reservists are treated like active duty military currently and that there are now stop-loss measures implemented so one must add 3 more years to active duty.

But how is he going to do this, Busyman, while at the same time voting against a bill that would accomplish this?

Bush talked about Kerry cutting down the intelligence budget by like 70 (or was it 7) billion dollars on a whole other question.

That is a big difference, as you say below, you are going on memory.

Now I'm going on memory too but I'm pretty sure about this since I heard something similar before about stop-loss measurements in the military.

I know folks that lost their sons in Iraq and the dislike (to put it mildly) they have for Bush.

I detest war. But I also realize that when going through any grief process, there is a tendency to be angry at the loss of a loved one and to strike out to try to place blame at the loss. But when all is said and done, I hope that I would realize my son enlisted in the armed services and he knew the risks. (and one of those risks would be the possibility that all branches of government would send him into a very questionable war.)

Please folks get your facts straight before you are so sure of something.

I am surprised that you perceive me of being so sure of something, Busyman. But I do think I need to review the debate after reading your response, and I will.

[Everose]

Remember a bill has many components and both parties add unacceptable components to bills as well as acceptable components and a no vote for a bill untill the unacceptable component is removed isn't the same as voting against the acceptable component. don't fall for political games.


I am aware of this Vid. Although I have much more hands on experience with it in the local political arena. A bill, or an ordinance are often amended to no resemblence of the original intention. I am dissappointed that Kerry didn't rebut on this if that was the case. But I imagine he will, and hope he does.


Bill Maher

the full quote when i can find it[/QUOTE]


I will look for it in the funny section, Vid. First I read that Bush has no feelings and is a cold fish. Now I read that he is a girlie, way too 'feely'

[vidcc]

I will look for it in the funny section, Vid. First I read that Bush has no feelings and is a cold fish. Now I read that he is a girlie, way too 'feely'

Real time with bill maher..it's repeated on HBO tonight and probably every night for the rest of the week. I only watch it occasionally and caught the end last night where i saw the quoted skit......last 5 mins of the show.

[Rat Faced]

How big a "Contribution" each nation is putting in is Relative.

In shear numbers, the USA is far in front.

However, the UK has a much higher % of its entire Armed Forces there than any other nation.

We do have other responsibilities, including Defence not only of ourselves, but the British Dependancies and Colonies... of which there are still a few.

[spinningfreemanny]

My God I hate bill maher and I love dennis miller....


wonder why?