Patriotism = Parochialism

[Busyman]

First up, apologies for my lengthy absence; my funky PC suddenly refused to connect to the net... or anything requiring IP routing, for that matter.
Long story short, had to reformat to get the damned thing back online.

Anyways, back on topic...

Seems to me that we can agree on most things in this discussion, but unsurprisingly, religion has been the main cause of division and debate amongst us.

Just like it does out there in the real world.

Myself, I have no problem with folk who subscribe to any of the faiths, but I do think religion should be kept right out of politics.

But ~15 pages should be enough religious talk. What of patriotism and parochialism?

Fugley's first post in this thread said that if we were to truly gain a global society, we would eventually bemoan the loss of our own country's cultures.

Fugs, you are 100% correct on that count, imho.

It's already happening here in Australia, and has been ever since we entered into the US Free trade agreement.
(Don't go thinking I'm bashing America, hear me out.)

If anyone is to blame, it's the apathy of most of the Aussie population for letting what follows happen in the first place.

80% US content on Aussie cable TV. Complete with the obligatory waving of the stars and stripes and the singing of The star spangled banner at every opportunity... even during the kids cartoons fer cryin' out loud.
All thanks to Rupert bloody Murdoch.

McDonald's logos appearing on the game ball during the AFL (Australian Rules football) Grand Final.

Iconic Aussie companies are being sold off to US corporations one by one.
Even ownership of our public utilities is heading overseas (although I admit most of them are being sold off to French or UK companies).

Children play less tennis and football (Aussie Rules and Soccer), but basketball, baseball and gridiron are rapidly gaining popularity.

It's gotten to the point where I've even invented a name for it: Cultural irrelevence.
Hell, we have wiggers living just a few doors down the street, ffs.

But is this the loss of my culture or is it merely big businesses exploiting a new market with unexpected side effects?

It's a bit hard to tell. Only a conspiracy theorist would accuse overseas goverments of plotting to gradually assimilate a smaller nation by waging a subtle war via entertainment, commerce and advertising.

But it sure feels like that's just what's happening. There's even been public discussions at my local university about whether Australia should become a US state so we can benefit from the stronger US dollar.

Funny thing is, my culture is far from being the first one here. The Indigenous Australians must be laughing fit to burst.
After 200 years, the white fellas are finally getting a taste of thier own medicine.

Yes yes, I know. I'm just being parochial.

Most of this sounds market driven to me. It seems you don't like it.
Soccer is the most popular sport but basketball is the fastest growing sport in the world.
McDonald's is the biggest restarant chain in the world.

It sounds to me like you are pissed off and added a couple of sentences saying the opposite and adding a to detract from a rant.

It's like me complaining of too many Koreans owning dry-cleaning stores.

America is a capitalist society. What country doesn't want others just like them? As you say, it brings us closer...

[uNz[i]]

Most of this sounds market driven to me. It seems you don't like it.
Soccer is the popular sport but is the fastest growing sport in the world.
McDonald's is the biggest restarant chain in the world.

It sounds to me like you are pissed off and added a couple of sentences saying the opposite and adding a to detract from a rant.

It's like me complaining of too many Koreans owning dry-cleaning stores.

America is a capitalist society. What country doesn't want others just like them? As you say, it brings us closer...

Sure, for the most part, it is a rant. The last couple of sentences are just me trying to take the edge off and be fair - at least a bit, anyways.
Call it a fault.

And of course I'm pissed off about this. I wouldn't have bothered with all that typing unless I felt strongly about it.

However, I wonder how you would feel if AU did to the US what the US is doing to AU? Market driven or otherwise.

Would you get pissed off about it if the situation were reversed?
Do you care about your culture enough to want to hang onto some of it?
Would any American? Do I even need to ask?

As for who runs the dry cleaners, that's hardly going to be a threat to an entire nation's culture.

And sure, commerce will bring us closer... for a while. Expect a backlash eventually though.

[Rat Faced]

Calling McDonalds a Resturant is probably the funniest thing in this thread...

Doesnt even deserve the title Cafe or Diner, so to name it after "Quality" eating establishments...

[Busyman]

Sure, for the most part, it is a rant. The last couple of sentences are just me trying to take the edge off and be fair - at least a bit, anyways.
Call it a fault.

And of course I'm pissed off about this. I wouldn't have bothered with all that typing unless I felt strongly about it.

However, I wonder how you would feel if AU did to the US what the US is doing to AU? Market driven or otherwise.

Would you get pissed off about it if the situation were reversed?
Do you care about your culture enough to want to hang onto some of it?
Would any American? Do I even need to ask?

As for who runs the dry cleaners, that's hardly going to be a threat to an entire nation's culture.

And sure, commerce will bring us closer... for a while. Expect a backlash eventually though.

America is a different animal somewhat. We are used to other cultures coming in to the fray. If something is popular there is a reason for it.....MOST PEOPLE SEEM TO LIKE IT. DUHH.

You sit there and complain about McDonald's....well don't eat there...and furthermore if it really pisses you off then try to get your Australian brethren to do the same. Tell the AFL to not sell out by not smearing McDonald's marketing feces on your football.

If Australia had a good TV show over here, I'd simply watch it, a good restaurant, I'd eat there and if people stopped eating at McDonald's to eat at Aussinald's then I wouldn't be fucking pissing and moaning about it.

The US isn't doing this to the AU. The AU is doing it to themselves.
Looks like you got some coercing to do with your brethren.

btw while it is polite, there is no need to apologize for being away when no one was looking for you.

[clocker]

And of course I'm pissed off about this. I wouldn't have bothered with all that typing unless I felt strongly about it.

However, I wonder how you would feel if AU did to the US what the US is doing to AU? Market driven or otherwise.

Would you get pissed off about it if the situation were reversed?
Do you care about your culture enough to want to hang onto some of it?

Fine then.
Define "culture".
To use some examples from your "rant":
"Children play less tennis and football (Aussie Rules and Soccer), but basketball, baseball and gridiron are rapidly gaining popularity."
Hmmm.
All of those games involve running around and doing something with/to a ball, but the former somehow embody your culture while the latter do not.
Obviously, to you, Australian culture is contained in the narrow and (relatively) insignificant differences in the rules of these games.

"Iconic Aussie companies are being sold off to US corporations one by one.
Even ownership of our public utilities is heading overseas (although I admit most of them are being sold off to French or UK companies)."
Iconic American companies are either being sold off or have moved offshore too (who knows where Levis are made these days? NOT San Francisco....) and, in today's corporate world, I doubt that there even is such a thing as an "American" corporation. There may be an American corporate headquarters, but the money rivers flow beyond and unheeding of national borders.
The only truly "American" companies that I can think of offhand are the ones that have failed spectacularly...Enron, Worldcom and the like.
Perhaps American "culture" is embodied by the Ponzi schemes so beloved of recent failed companies.
But Ponzi was Italian, so that can't be it either.

I can't think of any particularly binding definitions of American culture and don't bemoan the loss if it...whatever "it" might have been.
Can you do better with your definitions?

[uNz[i]]

Well as you know I did my best... but then everything vanished in the mysterious manner as has been the trend in here of late.

Deus ex machina? Or just another blockhead with a chip on a hunched little shoulder?

[clocker]

Yes I do recall.
Your answer was a model of rational riposte, well reasoned and thoughtful.

And now it's vanished.

Que sera, sera.

[j2k4]

It seems the episode hasn't quite ended, huh?

Well, then.

Do we have a consensus as to who/what constitutes the offending party?

I have an idea.

We could start a thread in the guest section where we could all post without logging in, and, if we can trust our mod crew to forego use of their mod-toolboxes for the time being, perhaps we could empty our mud-buckets at each other, and we could likewise issue an open invite to any mischievious types (Rikk, are you listening?) to participate, all with the understanding that order should be maintained, with an eye/ear towards peaceful future co-existence.

Kind of like the United Nations, yes?

I think I'll go start it right now.