why not death penalty?

[bigboab]

How do you know it's not a deterrent?

Is the wrath of God a deterrent?

As far as I am aware, the Wrath Of God does not, hook you up to several thousand volts, give you a lethal injection or hang you by the neck till you are dead.

[JPaul]

Actually, for most of human history, that "platform" has been exactly what people were in favor of.
Christians of all stripes bought into it just as avidly as everyone else.

Indeed, so why change now, it's worked for thousands of years.

I accept that you want revenge for certain crimes. However I cannot accept that it is the only "sane response". To think that violence should be remedied with violence is not the only way.

[Busyman]

Sorry, I was replying to what you said (in the post prior to mine, where you seemed to agree with FKDUP), allied to my own belief that your level of crime for which it was a penalty was no lower than our's.

What makes you think it is a deterrent. I see nothing to support this.

Hmm I asked you how do you know it's not a deterrent?

I then asked is the wrath of God a deterrent?

[fkdup74]

People like FCKDUP will see killing people as just and make statements containing the words 'fry' and 'zap' like it's a Batman review.

meh, you attempt to take an intellectual POV in a debate,
then go and do something totally ignorant...you generalize
people are too complex to put into a category,
because of the use of a couple of "comic book" exclamations
besides, I never liked Batman, or any DC comics for that matter
Marvel pwns Image pwns DC bites

oh i forgot to mention, while sitting in the courtroom....
I could pull the hood back occasionally....and smile a death's head grin....
so the bastard can at least see the face of the reaper
yeah, so...maybe I am a bit twisted, but....
what of the guy that REPEATEDLY bludgeons an infant,
because he doesnt want to hear the crying?
you fucking liberals...THINK OF THE VICTIMS FFS!
you lot really do disgust me, wanting to let some demented piece of shit like that live
"oh...it's wrong to take a life...wah wah wah!"
how about the 3 month old child that will never.....
grow up to maybe become a doctor of great significance?
or, now this should hit home for some of you, the next great civil rights activist?
or maybe just be a kid and play little league baseball and eat too much candy?
what of the woman who just orphanized three kids....
because some fucking freak broke in to her house, sodomized her and cut her throat?
the world is not some fucking perfect Mary Poppins fairy tale FFS
but some of you want to spin it that way,
with your "killing is wrong, gun owner ship is wrong, wahwahwah etc etc etc"
so you would have the innocent stand defenseless to any and all evils?
maybe we should strap some of YOU into a chair and hit the switch

[JPaul]

If you think that the answer to violence is more violence that's fine, it's a matter for you.

However you lower your level to that of the killer, when you kill him / her. You become no better than them when you fry or zap them.

A civilized society should be able to behave better than it's worst members. Particularly when there are alternatives.

The death penalty is nothing more than public revenge. People look at other parts of the world and are shocked at floggings, take a look at what you yourselves legally do, you kill people who are no longer a danger to anyone.

Oh, am I supposed to say wahwahwah now.

[fkdup74]

If you think that the answer to violence is more violence that's fine, it's a matter for you.

However you lower your level to that of the killer, when you kill him / her. You become no better than them when you fry or zap them.

A civilized society should be able to behave better than it's worst members. Particularly when there are alternatives.

The death penalty is nothing more than public revenge. People look at other parts of the world and are shocked at floggings, take a look at what you yourselves legally do, you kill people who are no longer a danger to anyone.

Oh, am I supposed to say wahwahwah now.

you liberals really take the cake you know?
but, since that is the way you want it.....
how about this:
if you people are so opposed to the death penalty,
YOU carry the financial burden of housing & feeding those inmates
take a vote, if the voter is opposed, he/she is taxed
if the voter is in favor of the death penalty, he/she should be exempted from said tax
how much will you pay for a "clean conscience"?
keep in mind, that's food, housing, clothing, medication, hot water, cable tv,
electricity, public defenders, transportation, the list goes on and on
(yes, they get cable tv now I am told)
Busy said it best....prisoners are coddled too much these days

[vidcc]

I agree with this

quite simply, there should be no plea bargain, IMO
if a state is going to employ the death penalty, then stick with it
i.e....if they fry one serial bomber, fry em all
regardless of the political, religious, or whatever, nature of the murder(s), bombing(s), etc
otherwise do away with the penalty all together

I'm afraid the the way you put the rest of your argument seems more of a lynch mob rant than calm debate.
@all
I am for the death penalty as I already stated, but it is not a deterrent, it is punishment. I am not for flippant use of it but some people commit crimes so bad they deserve to die..it's that simple for me. However if we suddenly decided to do away with it and make the toughest punishment life in prison with no chance of parole I wouldn't be upset in the least.

I agree that ideally any civilised society would abhor the death penalty and I believe that we do feel uncomfortable about it which is why apart from witnesses they are carried out in private and not public.
Also we now use lethal injection mostly which puts the condemned to sleep before the lethal drugs are administered so the only "suffering" is knowing that death is here.

[manker]

you liberals really take the cake you know?
but, since that is the way you want it.....
how about this:
if you people are so opposed to the death penalty,
YOU carry the financial burden of housing & feeding those inmates
take a vote, if the voter is opposed, he/she is taxed
if the voter is in favor of the death penalty, he/she should be exempted from said tax
how much will you pay for a "clean conscience"?
keep in mind, that's food, housing, clothing, medication, hot water, cable tv,
electricity, public defenders, transportation, the list goes on and on
(yes, they get cable tv now I am told)
Busy said it best....prisoners are coddled too much these days

Yes mate, and the way to acheive this paying for the upkeep of convicted criminals is by voting for a likeminded political candidate, which I do at every opportunity. So clearly I'm already willing to pay for it, as is every other 'wailing liberal' that is opposed to the death penalty.

Fairly obvious I'd have thought.


As to the other comments about taking an intellectual standpoint and then generalising. Well, it was only while referring to you ... if you're going to post like a comic book character then I might just respond in kind, mr zap happy.

[vidcc]

if you people are so opposed to the death penalty,
YOU carry the financial burden of housing & feeding those inmates

Depending on the age of the prisoner (younger will probably live longer) It is a very close race when it comes to costs. Financially life may be the cheaper option.

Add up all the appeal costs and care of the condemned up to the disposal of the body and I would think that it could be about the same as life without parole.....
Oh and I think the system needs the appeals to remove mistakes...but then I think that beyond reasonable doubt is not good enough to hand out death in the first place.

[JPaul]

I think it's beyond all reasonable doubt, not just beyond reasonable doubt.

But I could be wrong there, or maybe that's just the UK.

Or maybe it's just more pish that I dreamt up.