Isn't Filesharing A Socialist Activity?

[jetje]

anarchisme = liberal socialisme, so basicly you agree.. B)

[J'Pol]

Originally posted by Allende1973@18 May 2003 - 22:26
It is socialist, because ultimately what we are engaged in is creating a collective, where all digital media is freely available to all. This is revolutionary because the multi nationals are no longer in control, and unless they can stop us they will wither away and die.
Just because I own a PC, I don't see that disqualifies me from being a socialist, or from using it for socialist means.
Of course those whose means are least do not have access to the collective. That is a criticism of global politics and not of filesharing. Socialism has always involved any tools at your disposal.

I think it is also certainly anti-american, in that filesharing is anti-capitalism. The irony is millions of Americans are subverting their own capitalist system.
I agree most filesharers never consider the politics of filesharing, but filesharing is always a political act.

Bunkum

1. Socialism is not the creation of a collective. It is the creation of a society where those who are capable of producing do so. They also ensure that everyone's needs are met. No "I'm all right jack" attitude.

2. The fact that other people do not own a PC is the issue here. As they are the most needy and do not have access to the files then the filesharing process, by definition, cannot be described as Soclialist.

This is not a criticism of either Socialism or Filesharing. Just a statement that they are not the same thing.

[Darth Sushi]

Socialist? Communist? I prefer pirate or cheap bastard who don't want to pay for music and movies. It's more pleasing to the ear.

[MagicNakor]

I think it's a stretch to equate filesharing with political motives in the first place, really. Otherwise we can equate political motives to anything. "I only buy organically grown fruit so I'm helping out the Green Party."

[Switeck]

Originally posted by Allende1973@18 May 2003 - 16:26
It is socialist, because ultimately what we are engaged in is creating a collective, where all digital media is freely available to all. This is revolutionary because the multi nationals are no longer in control, and unless they can stop us they will wither away and die.
Just because I own a PC, I don't see that disqualifies me from being a socialist, or from using it for socialist means.
Of course those whose means are least do not have access to the collective. That is a criticism of global politics and not of filesharing. Socialism has always involved any tools at your disposal.

I think it is also certainly anti-american, in that filesharing is anti-capitalism. The irony is millions of Americans are subverting their own capitalist system.
I agree most filesharers never consider the politics of filesharing, but filesharing is always a political act.

Where all industries are owned by the government and goods are given out by the government rather than sold is communism.
State-sponsorship of companies/industries and price supports are socialist government intervention.
Gray and black markets are laissez-faire capitalism. ("Prices" are set by what people are willing to pay/do to get what they want possibly in disregard of government controls.)
Guess which one file sharing falls under.

If it is 'anti-American' behavior then so too was the Boston Tea Party, which dumped a state-supported company's tea into the bay. The creation and enforcement of copyrights, trademarks, and patents are socialist government supports of a company or industry and often results in huge government-supported monopolies/oligarchies. Were we actually 'dumping tea', we'd be DESTROYING ORIGINAL CDs in stores (literally burning them ) instead of just copying them. What we're doing is closer to smuggling or at very worst theft-of-services (usually from the record company, because the artists seldom own rights to music they made.)

If we are reducing any value on the goods we are sharing (often imperfect copies of), it is the artificial/inflated prices we are reducing. (see also: music industry convicted of illegal price-fixing and cost the U.S. music consumer at least $400 million between 1995-2000.) We are NOT reducing the price to 0, because you can't 'play this game' without a large initial investment (a computer) plus additional monthly funds (an internet connection.) By the same logic, there is resale value still for TV shows both to tv stations and consumers, not in spite of VCRs but rather BECAUSE of them. It was once possible for a music company to have nearly 100% control of the market and 0% market share just by discontinuing sales of old music or NEVER releasing a band's album because 'it wouldn't sell'. Filesharing has made that level of control nearly impossible. Still I think media companies will evolve instead of dying, like they did with VCRs.

Anarchy is anti-government/NO-government, lawlessness, and/or disorder/chaos.
Filesharing does NOT seek to destroy governments -- it doesn't blow up buildings, it isn't terrorism, it almost can't be used to make money (to fund illegal activities -- with exception of Kazaa Gold ), and it can't even 'reach' people who don't go reaching for it.

"I got a virus off Kazaa!"
"But you don't even USE Kazaa!"
"Yeah but I installed it on my computer 6 months ago and Norton says Kazaa.exe is infected -- so I must have gotten a virus off Kazaa!"
(These quotes are made-up but similar to what I've read online...)

You enter in a word you're searching for... you only get back a list of what others share which match/contain that word. You try to download from that list... sometimes you succeed, sometimes you don't.

Calling filesharing pure anarchy like saying GOOGLE is subversive. (China says it is...)

[thegroggman]

I only buy organically grown fruit

OMG! We dont take kindly to your tree hugging kind. Everybody...grab your torches..theres a green among us! DOWN WITH THE NADER SUPPORTER!

Oh and Switeck amen man. Relating filesharing to any form of political ism is ridiculous.

[MagicNakor]

I don't buy organically grown fruit. It was just the example I came up with. It's too expensive. And if I really want fresh apples I'll just grab them off the trees in my backyard.

Edit: And I think you're more green than I, friend.

[thegroggman]

And I think you're more green than I, friend.

GROGGMAN NOT LIKE LITTLE MAGE...GROGGMAN SMASH!!!!! No but seriously, yeah I thought that exact same thing after I posted it...oh well. Oh and, about the organic, yeah I was just being facetious. Ok...Ill let the rest of ya debate this some more...nite B)

Edit: Forgot to mention, that although I dont agree that filesharing is socialism, this is a great thread. Keep them ideas coming.

[MagicNakor]

I knew you were being facetious.

But I'm not a mage.

Because there is no magic.

[thegroggman]

*Sigh*...fine...Ill make one last post tonight...ahem [clears throat]

:x (its the only green one...)
GROGGMAN NOT LIKE SHORT LITTLE GUY WHO LOOKS A WHOLE LOT LIKE VIVI FROM FF9 AND ALL THE OTHER BLACK MAGES FROM THE EARLY FF's FOR THAT MATTER *breaths*...GROGGMAN SMASH!!!!