Here's an idea

[clocker]

Well, I took the small liberty of assuming ...

No, the liberty you took was to put words in my mouth.
I never mentioned any amounts/percentages- this has been all your doing.
I said " we arm the Mexican drug cartels", which your very own source article confirms in it's closing sentence.

So what if the real number is 17%?
That's OK?

Does your penchant for unfettered capitalism require you to consider 17% not too high but rather too low?
There's a huge demand down there- only three days truck ride from almost anywhere in the US- and we're losing marketshare to the Chinese?

[j2k4]

No, the liberty you took was to put words in my mouth.
I never mentioned any amounts/percentages

Ah.

Well, okay then.

To what/whom do you attribute the fact of American guns in the hands of the cartels - responsible gun owners, or some sort of criminal element(1), and (2), do you suppose any other country/entity might be responsible for an equal or larger percentage of the cartel armament.

Oh, and what do you think we should do about the guns, anyhow.

[Rat Faced]

... because it seems you think that 17 equals 90.

It's a brand of math I can't quite come to grips with, but hey.

Really? I thought you were a businessman.

This is called "Creative Accounting", used by Corporations in an unregulated Market

[clocker]

No, the liberty you took was to put words in my mouth.
I never mentioned any amounts/percentages

Ah.

Well, okay then.

To what/whom do you attribute the fact of American guns in the hands of the cartels - responsible gun owners, or some sort of criminal element(1),

Neither.
Stupidly lax control over sales/shipment of weapons is the root cause.
Perfectly legal- thanks to the absurdly disproportionate influence of the NRA.

and (2), do you suppose any other country/entity might be responsible for an equal or larger percentage of the cartel armament.

Don't see the relevance.
We can only control how our country responds and stopping our (putative) 17% of the arms flow is a beginning.

Oh, and what do you think we should do about the guns, anyhow.

I think guns should be banned, sales of the weaponry and ammunition should be terminated immediately.

[j2k4]

Oh, and what do you think we should do about the guns, anyhow.

I think guns should be banned, sales of the weaponry and ammunition should be terminated immediately.

Well, if that's what it comes down to, then we'll agree to disagree.

I don't want to be at the mercy of some criminal with a gun who decides he wants my stuff, and I want to be able to hunt if I like.

I have participated in myriad threads about gun control/elimination for reference.

[clocker]

As have I.

So you're going to sidestep the whole issue of shipping arms to Mexico under cover of the "self-defense" and "banging Bambi with my Barrett" line of reasoning?

Thank God you didn't stoop to the mealy-mouthed "Guns don't kill people...people kill people!" trope.

[j2k4]

As have I.

So you're going to sidestep the whole issue of shipping arms to Mexico under cover of the "self-defense" and "banging Bambi with my Barrett" line of reasoning?

Thank God you didn't stoop to the mealy-mouthed "Guns don't kill people...people kill people!" trope.

So your contention is that the firearms manufacturers are selling arms directly to the cartels, huh?

[clocker]

No, I'm saying that the arms maunfacturers, abetted by the NRA, have systematically gutted any attempts to regulate the sale and transport of weapons...which makes it absurdly simple for the weapons to make it into the cartel's hands.

[j2k4]

No, I'm saying that the arms maunfacturers, abetted by the NRA, have systematically gutted any attempts to regulate the sale and transport of weapons...which makes it absurdly simple for the weapons to make it into the cartel's hands.

Ah, good...thank you for providing me with this superb example of liberal-think.

Problem:

Mexican drug-cartel violence, at such levels and in such proximity to the US as to demand our attention/intervention.

Now, if we somehow manage to deny these fellows access to the 17% of their arsenal we "contribute", we might presume a corresponding drop in violence, yes?

So, let's say we do this, with utter efficiency, and further ice the cake by enacting domestic gun control whereby all arms are confiscated from the populace.

I submit that you would quickly lose the benefit of having deprived the cartels of that 17%, because you've done nothing whatsoever about the proximity problem, which problem would be worsened by the fact of the US citizenry having been disarmed...and don't say we could bridge the gap with border patrol or other law enforcement, 'cuz you know that's not happening.

One upside, though - at least we can feel better that we're not arming them, right?

Question:

Who do we talk to at the UN to see if we can address the problem of the other 87% of their weaponry?

Again, the math - ironically, if we actually could make some headway on that front - say we assume a reduction of 60-70% overall through a combined cooperative effort - don't you think that'd be a better solution?

Personally, since the border has become so blurred in recent years, I would propose we go in with our military (after all, the Mexican boys are there, right?) and wipe every last one of them out, scorched-earth-style.

We could bring our guns home safe and sound.

That's just me, though.

Funny; I thought I started this thread to talk about helping out Japan...

[clocker]

Ah, good...thank you for providing me with this superb example of liberal-think.

Thanks for responding with such a great example of conservative-think.
Which basically begins with a self-pitying tossing up of the hands- "What good will it do to disarm, when nobody else is doing it and only criminals will then be armed?"- and finishes with that well proven solution- "We'll invade with our military".

Had you somehow managed to include your belief in the innate goodness of corporations, you'd have a trifecta going on.

A man opened fire on officers during a domestic disturbance call Saturday morning, killing three of them, a police official said. Friends said he had been upset recently about losing his job and that he feared the Obama administration was poised to ban guns.

Another great example of conservative-think.