Anonymous is to DDoS sony...

Where I draw the line is the distribution. He gave away both a private firmware and the keys, albeit half the work was done for him. Again, I'm taking Sony's side because I knew it would happen, and I know the people who distributed it originally (to my utter dismay). As I said, it's like standing on a train track. You know the train is coming, so if you don't move out the way, why should anyone help/care? Did people really expect Sony to do nothing? And as far as I'm concerned, Sony's scare tactics worked. It's not like the PS3 homebrew scene came up with anything worthwhile. Look to the Wii for that.

If people had a legitimate reason for the homebrew applications, I'd be fine with it. As far as I can see, the only worthwhile things released are piracy-enabling material. No music backgrounding tools, no feature unlocking/save exporting homebrew, no custom drivers or reversed Move drivers, no 3D enabling in the menu, no bravia media playback enhancement dumping, no BD extraction, no custom XMB's, and the list I could come up with could go on - so tell me then, what was the point all these "hackers" were trying to prove? That they could enable piracy/homebrew/console emulation but then not do much else, it's still very much a locked console because no one wants to put the effort for anything but producing proofs of concept.

The only thing worthwhile from this entire fiasco was a signed permanent TN-D and VSH. :happy:

I'm still waiting for someone to lift the SACD decryption method out of the PS3 somehow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HsiWUC2S1nw

They aren't done yet

Probably the biggest production I've seen them put in a video....

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Originally Posted by Darth Rings

As I said, it's like standing on a train track. You know the train is coming, so if you don't move out the way, why should anyone help/care? Did people really expect Sony to do nothing? And as far as I'm concerned, Sony's scare tactics worked. It's not like the PS3 homebrew scene came up with anything worthwhile.

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Well except that he's in the middle of the road, and it's a giant SUV speeding at him, and the driver is screaming, "I'm going to ram you so hard motherfucker!". The other analogy makes it feel like there is no option for Sony, and that there's only one way to get into Sony's crosshairs. Anyways, I think the finalized statement from me would be if a company resorts to aggressive scare tactics, they don't have my sympathy. In my realm of opinion, this causes Sony to lose lots of points (not that they had many to start with), and Microsoft won back a lot of points (for a side story not mentioned in this thread, but it involves GeoHot). On another side note, does anyone remember the original XBMC, how hard did MS crackdown on that?

Jesus, less film making (the so called "15 minutes of fame", the disease of the modern age), more packeting!

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Originally Posted by Darth Rings

it's still very much a locked console because no one wants to put the effort for anything but producing proofs of concept

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You obviously don't understand the difference between developer and hacker. While one can be both, a hacker's primary goals are learning and challenging themselves, so once they get in, goal accomplished. Close the hole and they'll start again. It's developers that make content. Without full RSX access what do you expect? A new Tetris clone? Ports of 1980's-1990's games? Development is more attractive on PSP/Wii due to GPU access and on 360 (for a small fee) due to M$ support for indie devs.

Give the developers a legitimate(not under a very restrictive NDA + a cost of thousands of $$$) path and they will take and then people would see what the PS3 is capable of besides just games. You want it to do everything Sony? A legit brew path does just that, because if it doesn't do it some will make, "an app for that".
(P.S. Think there would be so many iOS apps if the iPhone hadn't been jailbroken?)

Aside from your obvious attempt at getting a reaction out of me ... how many of the things I listed in my previous post require any development? Actually, piracy requires development. The other things I mentioned (+ aok's SACD mention) are all the work of a hacker/extractor. I know the difference very well, thank you very much.

But that's irrelevant. I don't for a second believe that you were trying to educate me over anything.

P.S. Notice the quotation marks around hackers. I don't actually think of them as hackers at all, more like code junkies. They had the way paved for them. :whistling

It wasn't about a reaction. While I believed and still do you understood the difference between the two, many don't.(While directed at you, it was just as much directed at everyone else.) I even agree with you to an extent. If Sony hadn't taken anything away they originally gave me at time of purchase, I would have the same opinion as you as to GeoHot releasing what he did and how he did it. If they had given us a path for Homebrew, this would be a completely different conversation. Take away my rights and I'll take them back.

Second, as long as it remains "closed" you won't see anything worthwhile from the brew scene. It has to be Opened before that can happen and that's in it's infancy. Once we have either full CFW w/RSX access or if Sony gives us Linuxw/RSX access you will see the flood gates open, check out XLIG (Microsoft provides a legit path), Droid (it was open from the start), PSP (It's cracked wide open already), Wii(Also wide open). Simply put closed = no innovation(by anyone without a ton of $$$, hardware, and a license) and no brew. Sony with Linux gave us a promise of Openness(Linux itself is open), but when more was sought, they bricked the door up completely rather than just fixing the lock. Why? Because they didn't want to pay to support it any more. Any public company's motivation(whether they are doing what's right or not) is money. To think otherwise is to be a fool.

The term Hacker has a stigma associated with it. I also agree "code junkie" would be a better term("junkie" has a stigma also, but for many code can be an addiction :P, but not necessarily a bad one), or "knowledge seeker" or "knowledge tester". It's about the challenge.

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"how many of the things I listed in my previous post require any development?"

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Piracy takes reverse engineering of what was meant to make it secure which is development done in reverse before any development of tools, etc... can be done, but in my opinion it's part of the "development" process as is researching for making a new game without a single line of code written.

BTW, I put development in quotes as I'd like to know your definition of that. Writing code? Something else? Something more? (My equivalent would be "Digital Engineer" as sometimes creating something new requires you understand how something works to start with which implies engineering.)

sony loses in the public relations.
the new Micro$oft...

very sory that geohot abandon the sue and agree to compromise agreement.

The Sony MELTDOWN.

Oh yes, they deserve everything they get and then some. Bleed fuckers, bleed!

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Originally Posted by shipwreck

The Sony MELTDOWN.

Oh yes, they deserve everything they get and then some. Bleed fuckers, bleed!

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:happy:

I still have not had time (attention span) necessary to debate this with you, Rings. I have only made a few scattered posts recently regarding this in the News section. Others have made most of my points already. In short, consumers buy products based on their interests. Hackers break security features on these for interest, notoriety, politics, spite, and (occasionally) money.

My earlier comments regarding Sony products are true. The vast majority of them sold are mid-fi, made-for-the-masses consumables. Crack open a Lexicon surround sound processor, or a Bryston amp, or B&W speakers and you will immediately see the difference in design, function, craftsmanship- all elegant. All ahead of their time. All (except the SS processor) holding a good portion of their value. These things are meant to be repaired (if EVER necessary) rather than disposed of after a few years.

Sony does develop their BRAND- a marketing tool, as I said, by creating rarely-purchased, "signature" products in order to maintain an image that all of their products are of high quality. The PS3, in itself, is not junk. Unfortunately, the company is willing to completely disable it, and destroy paid-for features, along with creating root kits, and putting itself above the consumers' rights to enjoy their purchases as they see fit.

Sony is dangerous because they have the resources to make industry-standard laws that fuck the consumer. They place themselves, deservingly so, in the cross-hairs of consumer-rights champions (regardless of their personal gains- which could be varied, as I mentioned at the beginning f this post). Since this is a war, of sorts, over electronic freedoms, and the rights of the consumers, I chose those who offer me MORE choices (whether, or not I decide to take advantage of these is then up to me), than the ever-restricted ones offered by HUGE, anti-consumer corporations.

Who wants to fight with DRM on items they pay for? Who wants limited functionality on these items that, again, have been paid for? Certainly not me.

I buy music off Zune now because it's quick, easy, and DRM-free. I can't say the same about their videos. They are restricted (DRM), a little overpriced, and slow to download (clocking at 600 kB/s or 4.8 Mbps) compared to pirated versions (which I can grab at nearly 40 Mbps). Now I know how to remove DRM from Zune videos, but I hate going through all that effort just for myself. The point I'm making is if you treat the consumer right, even lowly pirates like myself will reward you with cash and praises. Tell me how Sony has been rewarding there customers, especially in the context of deterring piracy and their current methods. Even if there was a DRM free Sony marketplace, I wouldn't be spending a dime there. MS has not been pissing me off lately, so I feel comfortable spending money with them. Sony loses more than they gain, and everything that's been going on seems well deserved. I sort of kind of feel bad for the customers, but then again, they made that decision...

I've been following the story closely, and IMO, they do deserve it. Sony are one of the world's biggest corporations... they knew full-well that it is legal for people to modify their systems, and they knew full-well that forcing an update to remove Other OS breaks their side of the consumer agreement. They just figure that they could pay off a politician, hire better lawyers, and ultimately keep the free-market in a more powerful position than the opinion of the people. That's what they didn't account for; if you assume youre system is 100% fool-proof, then you aren't going to make much attempt in improving it - but ofcourse the opinion of the people rules; those hackers deserve massive kudos - DDoS was going to get the cause no-where if the facts in that IRC log are correct [anti ddos software upto 150gbit/s], and instead chose to hack into PSN servers, and by holding PSN clientel details ransom, they have Sony by the balls within every continent. If it is shown Sony did not put in place adequate protection against users details they face more costs in damages imposed by the government than any DDoS disrupting their service. And if it doesn't, the shit storm continues.

I don't know much about Sony's proper or improper behavior, so I'll just repeat what I said before: I enjoy the things that I bought from them... I bought some stuff from the PSN, and even though those hackers may have obtained my personal info, they didn't hack into my banking account because so far, I didn't notice any unauthorized charges coming from my banking account.

How about you leave these grow'd up discussions for the grow'd ups, Oleg?

I guess I should follow your advice; I don't know much about Sony's ethics.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5878345/gyqHh.jpg

:D

:lol: , but only because PSN doesn't have had my credit card numbers.

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Originally Posted by megabyteme

:lol: , but only because PSN doesn't have had my credit card numbers.

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Doesn't had? :ermm:

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Originally Posted by anon-sbi

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Originally Posted by megabyteme

:lol: , but only because PSN doesn't have had my credit card numbers.

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Doesn't had? :ermm:

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Yeah, I know. Weak Engrish, but I wasn't going to give them credit for having something that they lost. :P So, yeah, they "had" them.

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Originally Posted by megabyteme

Yeah, I know. Weak Engrish

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Fear not, after seeing college students write things like "he didn't went" nothing surprises me anymore. :D

Was it Anonymous or GeoHot that h4x3d into Sony's unencrypted database? :unsure:

Also, what on earth has this go to do with p2p?

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Originally Posted by iLOVENZB

Was it Anonymous or GeoHot that h4x3d into Sony's unencrypted database? :unsure:

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Neither

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Also, what on earth has this go to do with p2p?

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I originally posted this thread, as you can see by the front page, we cover news topics, that have nothing to do with P2P, and inquired why this wasn't front page news.

I say anything that involves issues surrounding digital media are VERY much on-topic. Without looking at the digital media, all we are left with are trackers, levels, and BT politics. :snoring:

These issues should be FAR more important to people sharing media than any of these often over-emphasized ancillary issues (trackers & stuff). It should be about what you do with the media- not how you get into sites. People sharing their experiences, and common interests regarding the movies, music, etc. will always be more interesting, and create a better community than one (as it has become) where people just want to get invited.

That said, Sony limiting our ability to make use of our equipment, and our media is a battle-line issue. Imagine how out of control these corps would get if there were not pro-consumer stands made over the years. They need to get kicked in the nuts every once in a while to remind them that consumers are in control- not them.

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Originally Posted by megabyteme

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Originally Posted by anon-sbi

Doesn't had? :ermm:

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Yeah, I know. Weak Engrish, but I wasn't going to give them credit for having something that they lost. :P So, yeah, they "had" them.

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Technically the hackers only made a copy of the database, the original wasn't stolen or lost, it's still intact.
Oh, the tenets of piracy and how they apply to even the most ironic of situations.

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Originally Posted by mjmacky

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Originally Posted by secmpromo

Thank you for unshared. I wish you success.

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I wish you a quick disablement by a speeding truck

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fixed. :happy:

Nothing to do with Bittorrent. Moved to Games.

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Originally Posted by megabyteme

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Originally Posted by mjmacky

I wish you a quick disablement by a speeding truck

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fixed. :happy:

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but you've got your threads all twisted, you're braiding dude

How's that, macky? You may not know him, but he is a perpetual ban-ee who creates pointless accounts only to say gibberish, and have them deleted in seconds. He's often referred to as J-Dye, but he's had over 500 accounts here.

Yes, a speeding truck colliding with his spinal column, leaving his body a useless pulp (one matching his "mind"), would be a just occurrence. :happy:

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Originally Posted by megabyteme

How's that, macky? You may not know him, but he is a perpetual ban-ee who creates pointless accounts only to say gibberish, and have them deleted in seconds. He's often referred to as J-Dye, but he's had over 500 accounts here.

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secmpromo? That's one of those stupid spambots. J-Dye did break the world record with his half a thousand dupes, though. :hooray:

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Yes, a speeding truck colliding with his spinal column, leaving his body a useless pulp (one matching his "mind"), would be a just occurrence. :happy:

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What about letting one of those gigabit seedboxes? ringhunter had a close encounter with one of those recently, if I remember well...

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Originally Posted by megabyteme

How's that, macky? You may not know him, but he is a perpetual ban-ee who creates pointless accounts only to say gibberish, and have them deleted in seconds. He's often referred to as J-Dye, but he's had over 500 accounts here.

Yes, a speeding truck colliding with his spinal column, leaving his body a useless pulp (one matching his "mind"), would be a just occurrence. :happy:

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No no sorry that was my fault. I thought the quoted exchange occurred on a different thread, and you put it in this thread by accident (which is why I said you got your threads twisted). What actually happened was that my reply also got deleted, and I wasn't notified of that. So I was just confused.

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Originally Posted by mjmacky

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Originally Posted by megabyteme

How's that, macky? You may not know him, but he is a perpetual ban-ee who creates pointless accounts only to say gibberish, and have them deleted in seconds. He's often referred to as J-Dye, but he's had over 500 accounts here.

Yes, a speeding truck colliding with his spinal column, leaving his body a useless pulp (one matching his "mind"), would be a just occurrence. :happy:

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No no sorry that was my fault. I thought the quoted exchange occurred on a different thread, and you put it in this thread by accident (which is why I said you got your threads twisted). What actually happened was that my reply also got deleted, and I wasn't notified of that. So I was just confused.

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Deleted posts are obnoxious. Been there, know how awkward the situation becomes. :pinch:

Derpy-doo:

http://filesharingtalk.com/content/9...for-data-theft

I'm a psychic

weak, so weak... what's the emoticon for waving your hand side to side in front of your face?

:ghey:

I hope you weren't referring to my post queer.

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Originally Posted by iLOVENZB

:ghey:

I hope you weren't referring to my post queer.

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No, I was referring to Sony tactics. What's up with the preemptive queer-by

Why else would you want a queer emoticon? :.ghey:

No I wasn't talking about ghey, but that could apply

the one I was thinking of is the "no, thanks" expression: # 3 at this link

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Originally Posted by mjmacky

No I wasn't talking about ghey, but that could apply

the one I was thinking of is the "no, thanks" expression: # 3 at this link

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I think the :wave:-smiley is the closest you can get to that.

I looked, tried to find a "pew, that stinks" wave which would have been close enough