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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Skiz
Take your pick; it applies to both. :whistling:
How? just saying it's so doesn't make it so. Explain exactly what the pickle is and how it's the Unions fault. :whistling
Quote:
Originally Posted by
devilsadvocate
That's not what I'm talking about. A mechanic fixes the car. The customer is paying to have his car fixed, not the person watching over the mechanic. The mechanic is the one generating money for the company. The other staff may be a needed part of a team, but they are not generating money.
That's just silly. I won't even entertain that logic.
Ah, the sidestep.:whistling
Quote:
Originally Posted by
devilsadvocate
You are going to have to clear this up. Are you in a debt recovery dept. or do you bring old customers back?
If it's the latter then you can claim your dept. (if not you specifically in your role as supervisor) generates revenue. If it's the first then that loss prevention not revenue generating.
Are you actually trying to tell me what my job is? You're incorrect on both assumptions.
My job is very intricate and not really something I want to get into in this thread or any other.
You raised the subject. I have no doubt you are a cog in the machine. I just doubt your job actually generates revenue. :whistling
If every supervisor in your dept. was off work sick, but the people under you continued to do their job ( because you have quality staff ) would your dept. lose money, make more or be pretty much the same? :whistling
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
devilsadvocate
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Skiz
Take your pick; it applies to both. :whistling:
How? just saying it's so doesn't make it so. Explain exactly what the pickle is and how it's the Unions fault. :whistling
That's just silly. I won't even entertain that logic.
Ah, the sidestep.:whistling
Quote:
Originally Posted by
devilsadvocate
You are going to have to clear this up. Are you in a debt recovery dept. or do you bring old customers back?
If it's the latter then you can claim your dept. (if not you specifically in your role as supervisor) generates revenue. If it's the first then that loss prevention not revenue generating.
Are you actually trying to tell me what my job is? You're incorrect on both assumptions.
My job is very intricate and not really something I want to get into in this thread or any other.
You raised the subject. I have no doubt you are a cog in the machine. I just doubt your job actually generates revenue. :whistling
If every supervisor in your dept. was off work sick, but the people under you continued to do their job ( because you have quality staff ) would your dept. lose money, make more or be pretty much the same? :whistling
Since they're all in a union, I think it's implied they'd all show up and then sit there picking their noses or something if no one is watching. Quality staff or not.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Certainly, anyone who has ever dealt with a union (as I did when doing trade show graphics) can supply endless stories about sloth and convoluted rules ("No, you can't plug in that light, you need a union electrician to come do it for you").
What I find interesting is that the right now wants to "crush" unions because of the obvious flaws in the process (and the illusory "drag on the economy" they supposedly engender) but other players in the system (like banks!) get a free pass and are even shielded from criticism.
Are unions really the biggest problem we face, or are they simply the fattest, lowest hanging fruit on a tree that is corrupt to the apex?
Is it any surprise that unions are among the biggest Democratic supporters and are the focus on supposedly sincere deficit hawks ire?
No, it isn't.
The war against unions is simply a naked political attack on the left, disguised as responsible economic policy.
It's a sham, we're getting screwed.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Snee
Since they're all in a union, I think it's implied they'd all show up and then sit there picking their noses or something if no one is watching. Quality staff or not.
Ha ha ha! :)
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
clocker
Certainly, anyone who has ever dealt with a union (as I did when doing trade show graphics) can supply endless stories about sloth and convoluted rules ("No, you can't plug in that light, you need a union electrician to come do it for you").
What I find interesting is that the right now wants to "crush" unions because of the obvious flaws in the process (and the illusory "drag on the economy" they supposedly engender)
It's not an illusion. Unions have been so successul-- perhaps too successful-- at getting higher salaries, better working conditions, job security, and some might say ridiculously lavish benefits, that we cannot compete with hardly anyone else in the world, even when you figure in the high cost of shipping the products to us over the ocean.
We already have federal labor laws that would prevent most of the abuses from the 1800s and early 1900s which gave rise to the unions. They are no longer needed, and they are dragging us down.
but other players in the system (like banks!) get a free pass and are even shielded from criticism.
True conservatives, such as the Tea Party are critical of them.
Are unions really the biggest problem we face, or are they simply the fattest, lowest hanging fruit on a tree that is corrupt to the apex?
If we could completely get rid of all unions, not just public employee unions, get rid of the E.P.A., change the law to make lawsuits from groups such as the Sierra Club much more difficult for them, and bring back tariffs, we might be able to turn around the manufacturing base of our economy and ultimately solve our budget problems through having a robust economy.
As a nation of consumers, we are spending more money on foreign goods than we take in from exports. This trade deficit is ultimately why we are in this mess. We cannot continue to spend more than we take in. The federal government and state governments are doing the same thing, but they are just symptoms of the underlying problem.
Is it any surprise that unions are among the biggest Democratic supporters and are the focus on supposedly sincere deficit hawks ire?
No, it isn't.
The war against unions is simply a naked political attack on the left, disguised as responsible economic policy.
Is it right for the taxpayers to pay for the unions to turn around and bargain against the taxpayers for higher and higher salaries and benefits? I don't think so. Is it right for a leftist organization to use taxpayer money to fund the Democrat party? I don't think so. Is it right to have a system where the union members know that voting for Democrats is the same thing as voting themselves a raise? I don't think so.
It's a sham, we're getting screwed.
Yes, by the unions.
...
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
999969999
Is it right for the taxpayers to pay for the unions to turn around and bargain against the taxpayers for higher and higher salaries and benefits? I don't think so. Is it right for a leftist organization to use taxpayer money to fund the Democrat party? I don't think so. Is it right to have a system where the union members know that voting for Democrats is the same thing as voting themselves a raise? I don't think so.
Not even 6 degrees of Kevin Bacon
The workers pay for the union, not the taxpayer.
The taxpayer pays for a service (work). Once that work is received the money has nothing to do with the taxpayer. If you want to tie every expense that the worker pays out of their own wages to the employer then perhaps we should go after churches, because I'm sure many government workers tithe.
How about this. John has a government job. He is payed by money raised from tax. He goes to the store and buys some beef. The store restocks with beef from your family ranch. The money from the sale goes to pay for your car.
Why the fuck is the taxpayer paying for your car?
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
I tell you what is taking the taxpayer for a ride and need to be stopped. Public employees that pay $5355 per year for 4 years then receive a pension of $26,600 annually for life. This is right away after 4 years employment, not wait until retirement age.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Kev! If you are going to watch cartoons, watch funny ones. Wait a minute....:lol:
It is a very hard job to evaluate teachers unless all their pupils are the same age and have the same IQ level and the schools have the same facilities. Roughly speaking(I come from a rough area).:whistling
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
j2k4
At 2:20 minutes into it, it gets to the issue of CHOICE. Perfect.
I hope Republicans will now start pushing for a voucher system which would finally make the public schools have to compete and permanently crush the teacher unions into oblivion.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Privatizing and outsourcing of government jobs is another great way to kill off the unions...
http://www.kpho.com/local-video/inde...deo_id=4602199
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
9, the fact is, you don't have enough information to either "hate" or approve of unions.
90% of your posts are unfiltered Fox newspap and the remaining 10% are clueless in the extreme.
You wanna outsource government jobs, eh?
Say, turn the fire department over to the same folks who perform Comcast home service?
Good luck with that.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
999969999
Privatizing and outsourcing of government jobs is another great way to kill off the unions...
Rentacops can become the actual police force (your new well below average mercenary protector and server)
FedUPS becomes your new postal carrier, $7.50 to mail in your payment for the electric bill
Child Services can now be managed by a mega corporation, that would naturally turn it into a child sex slave trade
Sounds ridiculous, but without government jobs, all of those services would be for profit, the real alternatives could be far worse
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
megabyteme
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Skiz
More union is not the answer. :wacko:
We wouldn't be in this pickle if it were not for the union in the first place. Call me crazy but having ALL employees paying a relatively equal percentage of their health benefits in order for ALL employees to receive raises based on a balanced scorecard consisting of performance, effectiveness, etc. seems mighty fair to me.
Your company is not paying you, or the union employees, based on profits. Without the unions, your company would be abusing you AND them. Union membership does not guarantee poor performance from employees, but non-union employees almost universally equates to abuses by companies. The fact that union members are working for the same company as you, and have received better treatment than you, indicates that your company will never be any more fair than it is forced to be.
If union members were required to pay for their benefits, it would not mean a reduction in your dues, nor an increase in your pay- simply an increase in company profits. Would this make you any happier? You may think you are on the same side as the company, but when it comes to profits, you are NOT on their side- you are simply a salary to pay (a cost who would be replaced if a cheaper/more efficient alternative became available). If you think you are on
their side, ask for a bigger cut of those profits, then tell me which side you are on...
To think that corporations pay employees based on profit is absurd. Salaries and pay rates are almost solely a demand-driven market, like most things in this world, as they should be. A good example is what's going on with the police in Austin. They're all puffed up about wanting a pay raise, but there's a 2-3 year waiting list just to get in the cadet school due to the overwhelming amount of applicants trying to get in. Should the policemans union win out by muscling the taxpayers into settling, or should the fair market dictate an appropriate salary by saying, 'wait a minute, we must be paying these guys fairly since there are thousands of people lined up ready to do this job at the current starting salary rate'.
The quote is also quite a blanket statement considering you know absolutely zip about my corporation, our policies, or our pay scale. To show you how wrong you are, the average length of employment (last years statistic) is 22 years. I've found by shopping around a bit, that I've not been able to find anything that can top what I'm currently offered. "Taken advantage of"? "Abused"? You have no idea what you're talking about. I have great benefits that are the envy of anyone I know. It's great to hear at a doctors office, "Oh... wow... you have wonderful coverage." We have stock options year 'round, profit sharing, management incentive plans, tuition reimbursement up to $4,000/year, an actual pension plan (which is extremely rare these days). Nearly all of these are programs are offered exclusively to non-union employees of the company.
I also don't pay dues, so when you keep saying that I do, you're again, incorrect. Even when I was an hourly employee I still never paid dues as I never wanted to be a member of the union.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Skiz, the only reason your company offers benefits to the non-union employees is they're afraid you'll unionize if they don't.
Lose the union and you all lose the benefits.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
By that methodology, all non-union corps, business, shops, warehouses, etc would have no benefits/perks, but that's far from reality.
Of all my friends and acquaintances, I'm the only person who works for a company that has any union of any kind in any capacity, yet they all have good perks, vacations, and benefits.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Really?
They have six weeks of vacation, fully paid health care and education, maternity/caregiver leave, etc.?
Good for you and them then.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
clocker
9, the fact is, you don't have enough information to either "hate" or approve of unions.
90% of your posts are unfiltered Fox newspap and the remaining 10% are clueless in the extreme.
You wanna outsource government jobs, eh?
Say, turn the fire department over to the same folks who perform Comcast home service?
Good luck with that.
You don't know much about Arizona, do you?
http://www.rmfire.com/aboutus.html
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
999969999
You make it sound like volunteer fire departments and the like are unique to Arizona. They occur around the country in more rural areas where local budgets can't afford more fire departments/staff/trucks. However, they do need funds to operate. Since you're so fond of overly politicized stories, here you go:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/1..._n_750272.html
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
clocker
9, the fact is, you don't have enough information to either "hate" or approve of unions.
90% of your posts are unfiltered Fox newspap and the remaining 10% are clueless in the extreme.
You wanna outsource government jobs, eh?
Say, turn the fire department over to the same folks who perform Comcast home service?
Good luck with that.
"Rural/Metro Fire Department's history goes back more than 50 years, when founder Lou Witzeman became concerned that his neighborhood lacked fire protection. He pulled together some money, bought a fire truck, and asked his neighbors to support this fledgling company.
With the company was also born a new way of thinking about fire protection and safety services. As a private sector company that partners with communities, Rural/Metro is dedicated to finding the most cost-effective ways to deliver the highest quality ambulance transportation and fire protection services."
Yes, I want to outsource and privatize as many government jobs as possible. Hopefully it will help destroy what is left of the unions in this country. And as Rural Metro has shown, a private company can provide excellent fire protection and ambulance service at a reasonable cost. Consumers then have the right and freedom to choose whether or not they want to pay for that service and protection or just roll the dice and take their chances that they won't need to ever use it, and then deal with the consequences themselves.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
999969999
Yes, I want to outsource and privatize as many government jobs as possible. Hopefully it will help destroy what is left of the unions in this country. And as Rural Metro has shown, a private company can provide excellent fire protection and ambulance service at a reasonable cost. Consumers then have the right and freedom to choose whether or not they want to pay for that service and protection or just roll the dice and take their chances that they won't need to ever use it, and then deal with the consequences themselves.
The point that you missed here is that it can really only work in a sparsely populated rural environment. This wouldn't succeed in urban areas, especially in situations where many residential units are in very close proximity of each other. Whether it be a separate cost or built into the rent, the "private" costs would be extremely high. There would also be no margin of "opting" out as you propose. If you are at the point where you'd have the government managing pretty much nothing... it would seem that you are with me in idealizing a complete anarchist society. You can't just leave your foot halfway through the door.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
I wonder...
After demonizing their work ethic, "crushing" their union and drastically cutting pay...who is going to want to be a civil servant in the future?
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
clocker
I wonder...
After demonizing their work ethic, "crushing" their union and drastically cutting pay...who is going to want to be a civil servant in the future?
Oh nooos, that's sounds like foresight, don't be silly... this is a politics thread
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
clocker
I wonder...
After demonizing their work ethic, "crushing" their union and drastically cutting pay...who is going to want to be a civil servant in the future?
Hopefully far fewer than do currently.
I will remind you I was civil service for years, union as well as non-rep.
It was a pretty sweet deal.
I concluded that no one should ever feel that comfy; it's just not healthy.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
j2k4
I concluded that no one should ever feel that comfy; it's just not healthy.
How about the heirs of successful business owners? :unsure:
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
megabyteme
Quote:
Originally Posted by
j2k4
I concluded that no one should ever feel that comfy; it's just not healthy.
How about the heirs of successful business owners? :unsure:
I don't know that many of them are overly sated because they are civil servants - do you?
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
So, let's clarify...
It's OK for the head of a bank to make millions but a civil servant should never aspire to income over subsistence level, eh?
In fact, the people who weave the fabric of your life shall be stripped of the benefits that anyone in the private sector would barter for (and commonly, receive).
Why not just impress prisoners into government work?
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Don't most of the high level politicians live pretty comfy, much more than civil servants. You're bragging about the lower rung aren't you?
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
clocker
So, let's clarify...
It's OK for the head of a bank to make millions but a civil servant should never aspire to income over subsistence level, eh?
In fact, the people who weave the fabric of your life shall be stripped of the benefits that anyone in the private sector would barter for (and commonly, receive).
Why not just impress prisoners into government work?
That works the other way over here.:)
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
999969999
http://abcnews.go.com/US/protestors-...ry?id=12947666
These people are ridiculous! They have job security, decent wages, excellent health and retirement benefits, and when they are asked to contribute a tiny amount of their wages to help pay for their benefits, so the state can balance its budget, they take to the streets and riot.
Their unions need to be crushed!
And the Democrats in their state government are such chickens, they can't stand to face a vote that they know they will lose because they are now outnumbered by Republicans, that they flee to another state to prevent the vote from going forward. Imagine the outrage if Republicans pulled a stunt like that?
This isn't just Repubs. Martin O' Malley is doing similar.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
j2k4
Quote:
Originally Posted by
clocker
I wonder...
After demonizing their work ethic, "crushing" their union and drastically cutting pay...who is going to want to be a civil servant in the future?
Hopefully far fewer than do currently.
Exactly! The size of government at all levels needs to be reduced.
I will remind you I was civil service for years, union as well as non-rep.
It was a pretty sweet deal.
And it is not sustainable.
I concluded that no one should ever feel that comfy; it's just not healthy.
...
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
megabyteme
Quote:
Originally Posted by
j2k4
I concluded that no one should ever feel that comfy; it's just not healthy.
How about the heirs of successful business owners? :unsure:
This socialist mindset is becoming so obvious among the liberals.
Where do you think the money to fund government spending ultimately comes from?
Yes, let's punish business owners and give them less incentive to make money and build up their businesses. This mindset didn't work well for the Soviets and it won't work well here, either.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mjmacky
Quote:
Originally Posted by
999969999
Yes, I want to outsource and privatize as many government jobs as possible. Hopefully it will help destroy what is left of the unions in this country. And as Rural Metro has shown, a private company can provide excellent fire protection and ambulance service at a reasonable cost. Consumers then have the right and freedom to choose whether or not they want to pay for that service and protection or just roll the dice and take their chances that they won't need to ever use it, and then deal with the consequences themselves.
The point that you missed here is that it can really only work in a sparsely populated rural environment.
http://www.ruralmetro.com/about_communitiesserved.asp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottsdale,_Arizona
http://maps.google.com/maps?rlz=1T4G...ed=0CCoQ8gEwAA
Scottsdale, Arizona is sparsely populated? Have you ever been to metro Phoenix? You don't know what you're talking about.
This wouldn't succeed in urban areas, especially in situations where many residential units are in very close proximity of each other.
Such as in Scottsdale, or many of the other cities listed on that Rural/Metro website?
Whether it be a separate cost or built into the rent, the "private" costs would be extremely high. There would also be no margin of "opting" out as you propose.
Wrong again. It is voluntary. Which is something that the left hates.
If you are at the point where you'd have the government managing pretty much nothing... it would seem that you are with me in idealizing a complete anarchist society. You can't just leave your foot halfway through the door.
You can tell a lot about a company by looking at its roots.
Rural/Metro's history goes back more than 50 years, when founder Lou Witzeman became concerned that his neighborhood didn't have fire protection. So he pooled together some money, bought a fire truck, and asked his neighbors to subscribe to his fledgling company.
Oh how evil! An entrepreneur! The enemy of the socialist left wingers! This must be stopped! Only government can solve all of our problems!
With the company was also born a new way of thinking about health and safety services. As a private sector company, Rural/Metro is dedicated to finding the most cost-effective ways to deliver the highest quality ambulance transportation and private fire protection services.
In 1969, Rural/Metro began operating ambulance services independently of its fire operations. Today, Rural/Metro has become one of the largest ambulance companies in North America, providing "911" emergency and non-emergency medical transportation services, as well as a variety of private fire protection services.
Today the company offers a wide range of medical transportation and safety services, not only to communities, but also to the private sector. Among the services we provide are:
Emergency medical transportation
Non-emergency medical transportation
Private fire protection services, including community, airport, and industrial
What began with one man's vision has grown today into a company with more than $500 million in annual revenues and 8,000 employees who provide health and safety services throughout the United States. Annually, Rural/Metro's employees respond to more than 1.1 million calls for assistance.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
me thinks it be a troll trollin and you all got trolled
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rdtphd
me thinks it be a troll trollin and you all got trolled
Yeah, let's not have any different opinions expressed.
Just the liberal opinions.
We don't want to hear from anyone who might be a conservative.
Only liberals get to express their opinions.
For all other opinions, just shut them down.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
There are so many flaws in every statement that you make, that when addressed, you make more points that have many more inherent flaws. Essentially you provide an endless cycle of idiocy that can only be construed as trolling.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
I will continue to present the conservative point of view whether you like it or not.
There are hardly any conservative voices on here anymore.
I was born too late for the Reagan Presidency, but from what I have read about him, and have been told about him, our current president wouldn't make a pimple on his ass...
Reagan: "In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem. From time to time we've been tempted to believe that society has become too complex to be managed by self-rule, that government by an elite group is superior to government for, by, and of the people. Well, if no one among us is capable of governing himself, then who among us has the capacity to govern someone else? All of us together, in and out of government, must bear the burden."
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn’t pass it on to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same, or one day we will spend our sunset years telling our children and our children's children what it was once like in the United States where men were free."
"Back in 1927, an American socialist, Norman Thomas, six times candidate for President on the Socialist Party ticket, said that the American people would never vote for socialism but he said under the name of liberalism the American people would adopt every fragment of the socialist program."
"One of the traditional methods of imposing statism or socialism on a people has been by way of medicine. It's very easy to disguise a medical program as a humanitarian project. . . . Now, the American people, if you put it to them about socialized medicine and gave them a chance to choose, would unhesitatingly vote against it. We have an example of this. Under the Truman administration it was proposed that we have a compulsory health insurance program for all people in the United States, and, of course, the American people unhesitatingly rejected this."
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mjmacky
There are so many flaws in every statement that you make, that when addressed, you make more points that have many more inherent flaws. Essentially you provide an endless cycle of idiocy that can only be construed as trolling.
I noticed you were unable to refute this...
"The point that you missed here is that it can really only work in a sparsely populated rural environment.
http://www.ruralmetro.com/about_communitiesserved.asp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottsdale,_Arizona
AERIAL VIEW OF THIS SO-CALLED "SPARSELY POPULATED RURAL AREA" (try zooming in for a closer look):
http://maps.google.com/maps?rlz=1T4G...ed=0CCoQ8gEwAA
Scottsdale, Arizona is sparsely populated? Have you ever been to metro Phoenix? You don't know what you're talking about.
This wouldn't succeed in urban areas, especially in situations where many residential units are in very close proximity of each other.
Such as in Scottsdale, or many of the other cities listed on that Rural/Metro website?"
So you just attacked me personally, rather than deal with the flaws in your own argument.
Typical of the left wing.
Shut down dissent by personal attacks rather than trying to win the argument.
My point is this... YES GOVERNMENT JOBS CAN AND SHOULD BE PRIVATIZED AND OUTSOURCED.
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Re: Public Employee Unions Must Be Crushed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by
999969999
Shut down dissent by personal attacks rather than trying to win the argument.
It's a bit difficult to tell what your "argument" is.
As I see it, you posit that privately owned, user subscribed (formerly) "public" services are superior to those supplied by the government.
Kind of hard to grasp the dichotomy here, so help me out...
After 9/11, the Right lionized as HEROES the first (and later) responders- the majority of whom were the very same unionized, blood sucking vampires that you currently demonize.
I guess they were only heroes as long as they were politically expedient (see: Rudy Guiliani) and didn't need health care (which Republicans fought tooth and nail).
You have also previously been a consistent advocate for removing regulation from business.
So, once you remove government from the equation we have FireFighters, Inc.- a private, for profit entity with no competition- as the sole source of protection.
And their incentive to provide comprehensive service at low cost is what, exactly?
BTW, 9...
Your new persona as the poor, abused , lone voice of conservatism is adorable.
It's a shame that the right wing agenda is so poorly covered in the media and your bravery, standing as the lone beacon of sanity in this rabidly liberal world , is edifying.
Well actually, it would be if you weren't wrong about pretty much everything.
