Should the U.N. get involved with the rebuilding of iraq?
I say yes
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Should the U.N. get involved with the rebuilding of iraq?
I say yes
My answer NO! America and Britain and Spain went in without a mandate. Why should the UN pick up the pieces?
No - The USA and UK threw their right to request aid for Iraq when they went against the judgement of the UN. Maybe if any other country was running the show for the UK & US would I possibly think about it, but for both countries to disobey the UN's word and attack a country on their own and yet have the audacity to ask the UN for support is beyond belief.
Last time I heard, the UK & US governments have spent a shitload on the war - If they can afford the cost to fight others on their soil, they can easily afford the cost to rebuild Iraq. IMO If they didn't leave enough on the side for the rebuilding, it's their own f***ing fault & problem <_<
well then what good is the U.N.?
It is there for taking appropriate action on a CONCENSUS of opinion.
Well I Agree with bigboab and Illuminati to some extent, America and Britain made the mess let them clean it up, but thinking about the Iraqi people and the track record of America and Britain, I would like to see the UN get involved only for the civilians, the people need aid, electricity, clean water and food. The UN is better at cleaning up humanitarian disasters then fighting wars. All that America and Britian seem interested in at the moment is killing more inocent people at check points, killing animals in the Baghdad zoo, and finding Saddam, its been months since the war ended and they still havent been able to simply supply power to Baghdad. I mean if the power station is so badly hit all it would cost them is a Generator for each street at the price of $1000 per generator.
So basically should the UN get involved ? Yes.
The UN should really be involved. It would draw the sting from those in Iraq who are supporting and hiding the ever growing numbers opposed to the occupation (and the chaos) as it would increase the expectancy that a legitimate Iraqi government was likely to follow in the near future.
Unfortunately, I believe the US administration has rather painted itself into a corner on this one, as to relinquish that amount of power to the UN would be seen as tacit failure of long term planning and tactics. This is not necessarily the case, but with an election looming perceptions are important.
Also, although it is understood in the UN that they should be involved, it is questionable how much countries like France, Turkey, Germany and Russia really want to get sucked into an expensive commitment like this. Unfortunately, although the coalition of the willing is made up of 30 countries only the US, Britain and Spain actually have serious resources. The rest have made a political decision based on wheeling and dealing prior to the conflict. They actually represent a net drain on US resources not a help.
In Iraq, the infra-structure is shot (literally) and the number of attacks daily is horrendous. For every Coalition soldier killed (a daily occurrence) there are about a dozen wounded and in Baghdad alone there are 15 to 20 murders every night amongst the civilian population. Across the country as a whole it is anarchy.
I have friends out there and they say it is a complete shambles. They have more robust comments regarding the people who sent them and the lack of foresight, but they are professionals and are doing a job. Hopefully, they will all return.
I think the UN has taken the right position here.
They have already told the USA and UK, when they asked for assistance that they will........IF the USA and UK hand over control of the re-building.
As there are multi-million dollar contracts being awarded to US firms, this isnt going to happen, so the USA/UK have been told to lie in their own mess...something that, by the looks of things, they werent expecting.
I hope the UN sticks to its guns, and does NOT get involved until CONTROL is handed over.
Yes I agree I hope they all return. I think if they had to go in(And I dont), it should have been swift, without any warning. Instead the Iraqis were given time to prepare for the type of warfare that is now taking place. Not one country in the world has beaten this type of warfare. Remember all this when the elections come along.
Well said, and I also hope all return safely!!Quote:
Originally posted by Biggles@23 September 2003 - 23:58
The UN should really be involved. It would draw the sting from those in Iraq who are supporting and hiding the ever growing numbers opposed to the occupation (and the chaos) as it would increase the expectancy that a legitimate Iraqi government was likely to follow in the near future.
Unfortunately, I believe the US administration has rather painted itself into a corner on this one, as to relinquish that amount of power to the UN would be seen as tacit failure of long term planning and tactics. This is not necessarily the case, but with an election looming perceptions are important.
Also, although it is understood in the UN that they should be involved, it is questionable how much countries like France, Turkey, Germany and Russia really want to get sucked into an expensive commitment like this. Unfortunately, although the coalition of the willing is made up of 30 countries only the US, Britain and Spain actually have serious resources. The rest have made a political decision based on wheeling and dealing prior to the conflict. They actually represent a net drain on US resources not a help.
In Iraq, the infra-structure is shot (literally) and the number of attacks daily is horrendous. For every Coalition soldier killed (a daily occurrence) there are about a dozen wounded and in Baghdad alone there are 15 to 20 murders every night amongst the civilian population. Across the country as a whole it is anarchy.
I have friends out there and they say it is a complete shambles. They have more robust comments regarding the people who sent them and the lack of foresight, but they are professionals and are doing a job. Hopefully, they will all return.
I agree with Rat Faced here - The people of Iraq must be helped to rebuild their country, but I don't really see the assurance that UN supplies would make their way to Iraq. My honest opinion is that if the UN must get involved, the "alliance" must give full control of the situation (not just parts of it) to the UN with no questions and no quarrels.
As for questioning the role of the UN - The UN is there to aid diplomacy between nations, co-ordinate international help where needed and to prevent unnecessary conflict; not to be the US's lap dog to do whatever the US says. That's Blair's job anyway ;)
I knew this would happen, Australia in it's wisdom of kissing arse deployed 2 thousand defence personal from support to SAS soldiers for the Iraq war which made us technicaly a larger contributator than Spain, but of course Australia gets eaisly forgoten if it was mentioned in the first place.
As for the UN they should only get involved if the US cedes power in Iraq which is hardly likley, the coalition made there bed now they have to lie in it. B)
Isn't it amazing that we haven't learned this yet, holy steaming feces. I think Mogadishu should have been the extreme lesson. Ambush, retreat, circle around behind, later, rinse repeat.Quote:
Originally posted by bigboab@24 September 2003 - 01:05
Yes I agree I hope they all return. I think if they had to go in(And I dont), it should have been swift, without any warning. Instead the Iraqis were given time to prepare for the type of warfare that is now taking place. Not one country in the world has beaten this type of warfare. Remember all this when the elections come along.
I think the grand miscalculation was expecting the freed people of Iraq to embrace us and expecting Iraqi exiles to be welcomed.
I am not sure how terribly wrong we were, but without capturing Saddam and all his men, his spectre is still very powerful in the minds of the Iraqi citizens.
If the US left today, I am sure Saddam whould come out of his bunker and assume control again.
Suddenly people seem to see the UN as a shining beacon of equality and goodwill, with a proven record of excellence. Remind me of what they have accomplished? They spent how many years trying to get satisfactory weapons inspections and now we want them to act unfettered to rebuild the nation. I personally wouldn't let the UN change my shoes.
I'm with Hobbes at least partially on this one, the UN is basically useless as a peace keeping force, and splitting military control too much while Iraq is in such a shambles is a recipe for disaster. I have no problem with ceding certain aspects of control in Iraq to the UN e.g. the setting up of the government and ideally the rebuilding of Iraq. However, I severely doubt that the coalition are going to give up all their lucrative contracts when its the only way they can recoup any of their money, so maybe it would be more realistic to offer some contracts on an open market through the UN and the others be split between the coalition nations.
As for financial aid from the UN, I think it will come eventually. France and Germany are both teetering on recession and will be under pressure from their respective populations not to help out the coalition too much, so it might not be a great deal, but they will want to be seen to be helping.
Edit: Realised i didnt' really answer the question, should the UN help out? Yes they should, although it sets a bad precedent where the UN is going to help out countries that defy them, not providing aid wouldn't really be punishing the UK and US, only the Iraqi citizens.
I am glad ppl with senses talking here
US and UK went against UN's advice and attacked Iraq without an UN resolution. That right there is illegal in itself, I am so sick and tired of the US bullshit to "free Iraqi ppl", "take down the oppressive regium", "fight global terriosm", "weapon of mass destruction". what a load of crap when in fact US is fighting for its own interests, getting rid of gov'ns that aren't in bed with the US, robbing Iraqi oil, and they expect us to support them? hell NO
I think US and UK should just be a man and suck it up eh? all this mess they made in Iraq (and not to mention all the innocent ppl they "accidentally" killed) and they still want money and troops from the UN.
I am totally disgusted.
*spits on ground*
oh yes I was getting high I forgot to say my position on the issue
No UN support until US and UK give up control over Iraq
AND I think there should be financial compensation from the US to help them rebuild Iraq eh? after all they did destroy their country. and none of that rebuild contract to US firms eh? that is just a load of crap.
US expects to make money out of a war torn country?
*spits on ground*