How Could This Still Happen?

security issue

So in an effort to become more secure we fingerprint foriegners, yet the frontline security in washington allows a man from the sudan (probably a code red passenger in the new category system that all airlines have to produce on all passengers flying into the states from next month) onto a flight carrying ammunition.
he didn't have a gun admittedly and the amunition on its own posed no threat but that's not the point..it is still a major flaw in security when we are expecting other nations to be watertight. What if he was a terroist and had an insider hide a gun on the aircraft?
this is not a rant about the fingerprinting but it is scary non the less

I suspect that if someone were found with a gun, whether he had ammunition or not, it would be considered a security risk.

However your point of the double standard is well made.

It appears that the US authorities are going to great lengths to ensure security regarding those who enter the country. However those leaving seem not to be so well scrutinized.

Perhaps they have assessed that a plane leaving the country is of no threat to you, even if it is flying through your airspace.

Or perhaps they feel no need to protect UK citizens, whilst protecting their own. That of course is their prerogative, however it does seem to indicate a rather sudden loss of collective short term memory.

http://www.news24houston.com/content/top_s....asp?ArID=22056

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Soldier kicked off flight for packing land mine
1/10/2004 6:59 PM
By: Associated Press

Denver-(AP) -- An Army sergeant was kicked off an American Airlines plane waiting to fly to Texas after an inert land mine was found in his checked baggage.

The man was released by Denver police, but the airline refused to allow him aboard his flight to Dallas-Fort Worth International Airport.

The Transportation Safety Administration says screeners yesterday noticed the land mine and pulled the bag from the luggage system at Denver International Airport.

The dud mine was confiscated.

The 24-year-old soldier, whose name was not released, could face civil penalties for trying to put a prohibited item aboard a flight. No criminal charges are expected.

Officials say the soldier apparently had been on active duty in Korea and was on leave in Colorado.

American is based in Fort Worth.

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I would like to know when he acquired the bullets. If he had them all the time what exactly did they do at Heathrow, that we did not do here, that would be informative.

Don't think we are to lax Jpol, I got to watch my mother be frisked randomly by airport security and they did a dedicated shoe inspection. I always had my doubts about my alleged "mother", but she has since scolded me for "profiling" mothers.

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Originally posted by hobbes@14 January 2004 - 13:48
I would like to know when he acquired the bullets. If he had them all the time what exactly did they do at Heathrow, that we did not do here, that would be informative.

Don't think we are to lax Jpol, I got to watch my mother be frisked randomly by airport security and they did a dedicated shoe inspection. I always had my doubts about my alleged "mother", but she has since scolded me for "profiling" mothers.

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:lol:

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Originally posted by hobbes@14 January 2004 - 23:48
Don't think we are to lax Jpol,

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I am a tad concerned now, I was previously unaware of the verb to lax. Should I be worried.

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Originally posted by J&#39;Pol+14 January 2004 - 23:58--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (J&#39;Pol &#064; 14 January 2004 - 23:58)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-hobbes@14 January 2004 - 23:48
Don&#39;t think we are to lax Jpol,

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I am a tad concerned now, I was previously unaware of the verb to lax. Should I be worried.[/b][/quote]
This bulletin just in:

A man with 5 bullets concealed in a Pez dispenser threatened the K-lite board. Although the arrival of the Mods scared him away, he did manage to escape with the letter "o".

A victimized Hobbes, wept uncontrollably to police as he described the abduction of his letter. All he could say was, "How will I ever live this typo down?".

An undisclosed Mod stated, "There is only one other member who shares this level of embarassment and I will refer Hobbes accordingly, and perhaps they can talk this through.

Warning level, for moderating porpoises

The bottom line is there will ALWAYS be security holes.

One cannot link fingerprinting with sneaking ammunition on a plane.
The are BOTH security issues and different ones nonetheless.
Sneaking ammo is a far more grievous and immediate risk though.

There is also a thing called Sod&#39;s Law.

If a politician says he will clamp down on under age drinking then that very weekend Sod ensures his kids will be caught in a pub.

In this case there was a song and dance about incoming security so Sod (aka Murphy) had no option but to apply his law and highlight outgoing security.

The Universe truly is a strange and mysterious place.

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Originally posted by hobbes+15 January 2004 - 01:08--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (hobbes &#064; 15 January 2004 - 01:08)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

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Originally posted by J&#39;Pol@14 January 2004 - 23:58
<!--QuoteBegin-hobbes

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Quote:

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@14 January 2004 - 23:48
Don&#39;t think we are to lax Jpol,

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I am a tad concerned now, I was previously unaware of the verb to lax. Should I be worried.

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This bulletin just in:

A man with 5 bullets concealed in a Pez dispenser threatened the K-lite board. Although the arrival of the Mods scared him away, he did manage to escape with the letter "o".

A victimized Hobbes, wept uncontrollably to police as he described the abduction of his letter. All he could say was, "How will I ever live this typo down?".

An undisclosed Mod stated, "There is only one other member who shares this level of embarassment and I will refer Hobbes accordingly, and perhaps they can talk this through.

Warning level, for moderating porpoises[/b][/quote]
:lol: :lol: :lol:

I manage t get the wee peek and discvered that it was sufficiently lw.

Ripping the pish therefre became a duty rather than a right.

We will catch the vwel thief if we all wrk tgether. This is the thin end of ther wedge, what wuld happn if we lst e.

What was his excuse? "Sorry, forgot to unpack the ammo from my trip to Afganistan".

Sudanese man going from Washington to Dubai via London. So he either brought the bullets with him when he was comming into the US, or he got them in the US. Either way there was a slip up in the Yanks part. Can you still buy bullets over the counter in the US?

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Originally posted by Alex H@14 January 2004 - 22:39
Can you still buy bullets over the counter in the US?

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there&#39;s been no legal change in regards to that. if you saw "bowling for columbine," you might&#39;ve gotten the impression that there was at least a trend against over-the-counter sales of guns & bullets. &#39;fraid not, though... it was simply one chain of stores, that michael moore got to change their policy via a strong dose of public embarrassment.

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Originally posted by 3RA1N1AC+15 January 2004 - 06:58--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (3RA1N1AC &#064; 15 January 2004 - 06:58)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Alex H@14 January 2004 - 22:39
Can you still buy bullets over the counter in the US?

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there&#39;s been no legal change in regards to that. if you saw "bowling for columbine," you might&#39;ve gotten the impression that there was at least a trend against over-the-counter sales of guns & bullets. &#39;fraid not, though... it was simply one chain of stores, that michael moore got to change their policy via a strong dose of public embarrassment. [/b][/quote]
didn&#39;t see the film, Michael moore is on record as agreeing with p2p filesharing of his film which kind of took away the wish to download it.... :lol: :lol: :lol:
but you pointed out something very valid internally. Our gun laws are really far too easy going.
one thing that i find kind of indicative about the acceptance of guns for all as a basic human right (supposedly to stop government oppressing us :helpsmile: ), in the town where i live there is a gun shop...a discount gun shop...right next door to a daycare nursery. i shall have to take a picture one day and post it.
as to the place he obtained the bullets is really irrelevent...if he had them when he entered the states then what happened to security worldwide ?
I read the story about the soldier before, he was caught red handed and i commend the security staff for doing their job, the mine was defused and no real danger in the soldiers eyes i suppose but a non firing replica gun is just as potent as a real loaded one to the person you point it at. that said a mine is a bit easier to find that a few bullets but it doesn&#39;t excuse the incident.
Mistakes can and will happen, i just wish that instead of waiting for a mistake to be turned into a lesson they tried to pre-empt the mistake.
The frontline security staff are doing a very hard job under pressure, often are not very well paid and often not appreciated for the reason they are doing what they do. This case raises a serious question about the efficiencey of the system and hopefully will become a lesson that helps us concentrate on the real security dangers

i didn&#39;t have much of a point in posting the landmine story, except that it was a tangent to the first one about the bullets. but now that i&#39;ve had a little time to think about it, bringing a dud landmine onto a plane is not only lunk-headed (what was he thinking, really? prolly not thinking at all...) but it&#39;s more irresponsible than one might suppose. if airlines are going through the trouble of paying for increased security, it may as well remain devoted to dealing with real threats-- every security employee who&#39;s off dealing with someone like him is one less on-guard against genuine dangers.